I have 8 month old twin boys and I wondering how everyone feels about this brand new swine flu vaccination for this winter. Do you think its safe to give infants this new shot that has barely been tested?
I suspect that it's been tested as thoroughly as it can be, in many laboratories around the world. Obviously nothing's 100% certain, but most governments don't play fast and loose when it comes to licensing new drugs, IMO... particularly for kids.
I would personally feel comfortable using anything my doctor recommends... but consult first as to how necessary it is in your particular situation. Apart from anything else, the doctor is pretty much bound to have better information than anyone here :)
I think it's important to remember that with almost any medical treatment, it's a case of weighing risks.
The difficulty is obviously that we really don't have particularly good information on any of this - although better on the first two than on the second. I don't know about Canada, but the current predictions in the UK make it sound like there's a pretty high probability of any one person getting the flu (I think the last I heard it was about 30%, which is pretty massive). I don't know the details of how dangerous swine flu is to infants, so I don't want to speculate and cause unnecessary scares - but I think it's worth asking your doctor or at least performing some research online. I suspect that the risks due to flu significantly outweigh those due to the vaccine, but this is as much gut feeling as anything else.
Of course, another benefit of the vaccine is to contribute to herd immunity. One of my irritations about the whole MMR debacle is that parents who don't vaccinate their kids at all against measles, mumps and rubella aren't just putting their own children at risk - they're putting others at risk too by lowering the herd immunity. Vaccination rates in London were very worringly low, last I heard :(
How I reached my decision is by asking my cousin who works at SickKids as a pediatrician, as well as my friend who is the Health.ca and Parentcentral.ca editor (so is inundated with H1N1 articles, info, questions) whether they would vaccinate their own children.
Both of them answered flat out, "Absolutely."
answered 19 Oct '09, 03:33
I just like to put the whole discussion into relation.
Furthermore I'd like to say sorry in advance, as I can only provide sources in German language.
In Germany, there are about 15000 people per year who die because of influenza.
Up to now, there is one dead person because of swine flu in Germany (who had different other health problems).
This page shows, that there are statistics that do not show any significant advantage for people who received a flu vaccination (they included only people below 65 years). In the text they cite an English source: (Effectiveness and Cost-Benefit of influenza vaccination of healthy working adults – a randomized controlled trial. Bridges, C.B. et. al. JAMA 2000; 284:1655-63 ): There are a lot of possible complications, the most common is an allergic reaction.
I think, everybody has to decide for himself, if this really poses a threat, or if it is jumping at shadows. Is the risk of not only acquiring the swine flu, but also for it to come to a bad, worth the risk of acquiring a defect from the vaccination. Especially if the vaccination is worth nothing after very few years. And the answer is probably different for every person, depending on the current health or other factors.
I just read an article in "Spiegel Online". A german paper with a good reputation. There they cite doctors, that advise against the vaccination for people that are immunocomprised (in this case people with cancer).
Problem is: those are the people who are most likely to get the swine flu (young, old, people with a bad immune system).
Furthermore (I have to say: if I understood that correctly) germany mostly bought the vaccine with an adjuvant, that should result in a more efficient immune reaction. This vaccine with the adjuvant is not released by the FDA (although the USA also bought it as a reserve - for worst case).
The article goes deeper even, but I think thats not to the point here.
As I think this is a pretty important information, maybe someone can verify this and post an english article/source for this?
It is my opinion that vaccinations in general, and the swine flu vaccine have not been adequately tested. The Swine Flu vaccine has been in development for how many, 6 months at the most? I think it is unconscionable to recommend that pregnany women and children be the first in line to receive this barely tested vaccination. Further, all vaccines contain a class of chemincals called adjuvants. These are toxins that stimulate a massive immune response. The stimulate an immune response because they are detrimental to the human body. Another aspect to consider is how many adjuvants will your child receive and how frequently? No one has studied the effects of multiple vaccinations over a given period of time. As such, it has not been proven safe.
Instead of focusing on vaccination, I think the focus should be on how to prevent infection, limit exposure, and most importantly, and boost immunity. All of these objective can be obtained using natural non-toxic means that pose zero danger to the mother or child.
I think we will see injuries as a result of the swine flu vaccine. I feel it is too risky and will not be receiving the shot myself, and neither will my pregnany wife.
answered 01 Oct '09, 17:10
Dr. Bob Sears, author of The Vaccine Book, has an article online discussing various issues related to the swine flu vaccine. He also was interviewed about it on a podcast called Parenting Unplugged. I would suggest reading the article and using it to formulate some discussion questions with your own pediatrician.
Personally, I'm planning to get my 6 month old vaccinated.
Someone on a list I frequent gave the following description of the swine flu vaccine:
So there isn't anything special about this vaccine except that they use dead H1N1 instead of one of the other variants. If you trust the flu shot, then you should trust this vaccine.
answered 01 Oct '09, 04:29
Both the regular flu shot and the swine flu shot contain thimerosal - the mercury based preservative that has been linked to autism. The way they make the regular flu shot is a by doing an educated guess on the strains of flu that are most likely to cause the most illness in a given year. They take the top few (I believe its 3), combine them and offer it as the 'flu shot'. The swine flu is simply another strain of flu virus which they expect to be rampant this year.
Personally I would not get either shot myself due to the thimerasol so I would certainly not give it to my child. Its my opinion from all that I have read, that its not safe.
You really need to do your own independant research and come up with the best plan for your family.
Here is some backup:
Since 1980, the documented start of California's autism epidemic, the number of new cases has steadily increased. Mercury-containing vaccines are still in use today, including the most recently recommended addition to the childhood immunization schedule, 2 shots of flu vaccine for infants, bringing the total number of vaccines up to 41 in California that a child will receive before the age of two. Building Wellness with DMG by Roger V Kendall PhD, page 105
"Probably 20% of American children, one in five, suffers from a "development disability'," according to Harris Coulter, Ph.D., Founder and Director of the Center for Empirical Medicine, in Washington, D.C. "This is a stupefying figure and we have inflicted it on ourselves. 'Development disabilities' are nearly always generated by encephalitis. And the primary cause of encephalitis in the U.S. and other industrialized countries is the childhood vaccination program. Alternative Medicine by Burton Goldberg, page 1101
Almost from the inception of vaccination programs, manufacturers added a mercury preservative called thimerosal to vaccines. The practice continued until recently, and was stopped only because of the outcry from parents and experts. The US Academy of Pediatrics and the American Academy of Family Practice did not warn parents or pediatricians that the mercury was dangerous until they were forced to. That mercury was toxic to cells had been known for over sixty years, but manufacturers apparently were more worried about lawsuits… Health And Nutrition Secrets by Russell L Blaylock MD, page 165
Vaccines are effective, but the production and use of vaccines should proceed more cautiously. Currently manufactured vaccines still contain harmful substances like mercury. The link between vaccines and autism is far stronger than the medical community is willing to admit, and more research in this area should be an urgent priority. Building Wellness with DMG by Roger V Kendall PhD, page 105
Rather than calling for an all-out immediate ban on thimerosal-containing vaccines, they suggested that parents continue to have their children vaccinated with mercury-contaminated vaccines until new stocks of uncontaminated vaccine could be made available. Here are two doctors' unions that had to be beat over the head with an overwhelming amount of data that mercury-contaminated vaccines were harming children far worse than the actual diseases against which the vaccine was intended to protect them Health And Nutrition Secrets by Russell L Blaylock MD, page 167
Are you surprised to discover that recent investigations have found that several doctor-members of vaccine boards were either receiving grants from vaccine manufacturers or held stock in the companies? They were willing to sacrifice the health of millions of children just to fill their pockets with cash. These people should be looking through bars, not serving on boards. Health And Nutrition Secrets by Russell L Blaylock MD, page 167
Multiple vaccinations, especially in newborns, are another major source of childhood mercury exposure because of the mercury-containing thimerosal preservative. Over twenty-two vaccinations are now recommended for children before the age of two! Health And Nutrition Secrets by Russell L Blaylock MD, page 64
Mercury and autism mercury toxicity is a suspected cause of a steep rise—a tenfold increase between 1984 and 1994—in diagnosed cases of autism in children around the world, according to some scientists. Specifically, the culprit is thimerosal, a mercury-based compound used as a preservative in vaccines commonly administered to babies and infants. thimerosal-free vaccines are available. If you have a child who will be receiving vaccinations, ask for and make sure thimerosal-free vaccines are used. Prescription For Dietary Wellness by Phyllis A Balch, page 198
Studies of autistic children have frequently shown very high levels of mercury, with no other source but vaccines found for the exposure. These levels are equal to those seen in adults during toxic industrial exposures. Several autism clinics have found dramatic improvements in the behavior and social interactions in children from whom the mercury was chelated. Results depended on how soon the mercury was removed following exposure, but permanent damage can be caused if the metal is not chelated soon enough. Health And Nutrition Secrets by Russell L Blaylock MD, page 166
Thousands of families say they can demonstrate with videotapes and photos that their children were normal prior to being vaccinated, reacted badly to the vaccines, and became autistic shortly thereafter. The number of vaccines given before age two has risen from 3 in 1940, when autism occurred in perhaps one case per 10,000 births, to 22 different vaccines given before the age of two in the year 2000. Building Wellness with DMG by Roger V Kendall PhD, page 104
Now all childhood vaccines have at least one mercury-free version, and I urge parents to ask for those versions if they choose to vaccinate their children. Injecting mercury into children, especially infants whose immune systems are still underdeveloped (hepatitis B shots are typically given at birth, before the immune system has developed), can be an assault to the immune system. What Your Doctor May Not Tell You About Autoimmune Disorders by Stephen B Edelson MD, page 65
I took my son to the doctor today for an unrelated matter. While there, the doctor reminded me to not only get both my kids in for regular flu shots, but to also get a swine flu vaccine for them when it is available.
From my perspective, because there have already been several swine flu cases in our area, I'm going to risk the vaccine if there is a chance of keeping my children safe from a much worse disease.
P.S. My 4 year old daughter got the nasal spray vaccination last Tuesday. It's now been 5 days with no negative effects. Because of shortages I'm still waiting on shots to become available for my 1 year old son. There also have been reports of children in the area dying from Swine Flu so I'm even more certain that my son will be vaccinated as soon as possible.
We were planning on waiting because there has not been enough testing on the shot. we will see if there are any side effects after the first of the year....we will also wait to hear what the doctor says when we go for the baby's appointment.
answered 24 Sep '09, 17:44