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There seems to be more and more controversy surrounding vaccinations these days. It's hard to know what the right thing to do is. I want to trust my pediatrician's recommendation when he suggests I vaccinate my son (who is currently 8 months old). However, my nephew had an extreme adverse reaction to the MMR vaccination at 13 months. He was a normal baby before, and within a week of the vaccination started having seizures and almost died. He is now 5 but now has a progressive degenerative brain disorder, seizes 10-20 times a day, and has the mental capacity of a 2-month-old.

How can I justify vaccinating my son when I have seen first-hand the terrible side-effects vaccinations can potentially cause.

(I ask this question not to be inflammatory or to spark a heated debate, but to get honest feedback and have a civil discussion)

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Since you're asking specifically about the MMR vaccine, I've found that Wikipedia has a really in-depth article about the MMR vaccine controversy: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MMR_vaccine_controversy It's enlightening. – Scott Sep 19 at 3:42

16 Answers

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How can I justify vaccinating my son when I have seen first-hand the terrible side-effects vaccinations can potentially cause.

By trusting statistics - which I understand can be hard to do.

Vast, vast numbers of children have the MMR. A very few of them will have adverse reactions like the one you described.

It's natural to take more note of the effects on your nephew than on children you don't know, but ask yourself how much weight you'd have placed on this one point of data if he hadn't been your nephew, but just one child you read about on the internet. It's the same amount of data with the same validity and relevance - but obviously your nephew is going to have more impact to your gut feelings. It's important (IMO) to try to put gut feelings aside and approach this logically. Yes, it can be very hard to do that - but it's in your child's best interest to do so.

Having said that, one thing to ask your doctor is whether your nephew's reaction could be relevant in terms of genetics: is it possible that he has a genetic trait making the reaction more likely? If so, can your children be tested for the same trait, given their close genetic relationship to your nephew?

As for the controversy around the MMR - I thought most of that had died down now, fortunately, at least around the Andrew Wakefield issue. Vaccination rates are still worryingly low in some places, but I believe they're gradually recovering.

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This is the correct answer - the reality is that vaccinations are turning into a Not In My BackYard issue. People don't want the diseases, but they assume that as long as everyone around them gets vaccinated, then they are safe. Unfortunately even vaccinated people can carry and spread the disease without ever being ill before their immune system kicks in. Those that are not vaccinated stand a huge risk of getting a disease that is virtually unknown in our developed world. That risk is many times greater than the risk of complications arising from the vaccination itself. It's gambling. – Adam Davis Dec 10 at 4:25
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Go with the vaccinations, without a doubt. There is a lot of bad information being spread around out there by a very vocal minority about the risks of vaccinations. The truth is, the risks are very low, and there isn't any conclusive evidence that there is any connection between vaccinations and autism. Many of those against vaccinations point out that the first signs of autism occurred shortly after getting vaccinated. Well, it also turns out that this is just the time of life that signs of autism typically start showing up, vaccinations or not - correlation does not imply causation.

At the end of the day, the tiny risk involved with getting vaccinated is well worth it for the diseases & illnesses they are preventing.

Reference: Wired Article

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Wow, I think you did a great job with your answer. Very well written. – Sabrina Sep 22 at 5:20
The Wired article you mention is a good one... but seemingly a bit biased in its own way. Even more interesting are all the comments below the article... both pro and con. It would be interesting to read his book(s). At the end of the day I think we can all agree that vaccination in history has SAVED more people than it has ever harmed... but I still pause and do my own bit of research before injecting myself with a "new" vaccine. I'd personally feel safer getting a polio vaccination than an H1N1 vaccination right now. – KPW Dec 11 at 6:15
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You should all buy yourselves a copy of Bad Science by Ben Goldacre.

Many of the scare stories about vaccines are questionable. In general the media does not explain science clearly leaving lots of scared moms around.

http://www.badscience.net/

Vaccines have changed the world for the better.

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9

Please get your kids vaccinated.

  • When you get vaccinated, there is a small chance that you won't actually develop immunity to whatever the vaccine is for.

  • However, this is usually not a problem since if everyone gets the vaccine, then most people will actually be immune. The disease won't spread if there is one person who is not immune as it needs interpersonal contact from two people who are not immune to spread. Since most people are immune, this is very rare. Thus, the few people that do not develop immunity will not have a chance to get the disease and be safe anyway. (This is called the "herd immunity").

  • However, if more and more people are avoiding vaccines because they're scared of them, then there are more and more people who are not immune to the disease around. Thus, the herd immunity is reduced and EVERYONE is at a greater risk, even people who get the vaccines.

So: please do your part for everyone and let's stop the spread of disease. Get your kids vaccinated for theirs and everyone's sake!

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Hi Mike. I agree with what you're saying, but for the sake of staying true to our principles (moms4mom.com/back-it-up), can you provide a link for further reading on the first point, and perhaps a link to the Wikipedia article on Herd Immunity in the second point? Thanks! – Scott Dec 4 at 22:11
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Thanks Scott, both are good points. I added the wikipedia link for the second one. The first one was based on a conversation I had with someone in medical school. I'm looking for a reference on the web to back it up but haven't found one yet. I'll update this again if I do. – Mike Kale Dec 7 at 4:19
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I suggest you look through some of the medical literature available. Asking others for what is essentially subjective advice isn't a good idea.

From a medical study I found using Google:

The study is particularly notable for its size (based on nearly 700,000 children under 6 years). They report that the risk of febrile seizures is increased almost sixfold on the day of diphtheria, tetanus, and pertussis (DTP) receipt and drops off to a negligible increase thereafter. For measles, mumps, and rubella (MMR), the effect is not seen until the 2nd week after receipt of the vaccine, where the risk is increased nearly threefold. They are also able to provide estimates of how many additional febrile seizures will occur as a result of vaccination with DTP (6 to 9 in 100,000) and MMR (25 to 34 in 100,000).

So yes, there's some risk involved. Read the study and consider the risks involved versus the risk of contracting MMR later in life.

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+1 Jason. This is one of those topics that can get political, and we would be quick to jump on it and close the question or moderate it if need be. Thanks for the informative link and quote! – Tammy Sep 16 at 22:40
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I thought I would respond to the specific mention of febrile seizures in the above posts. By definition a febrile seizure occurs because someone (usually a young child) has a high fever. The relationship to vaccinations is that some children develop a fever after certain vaccines. According to the following fact sheet they occur is approximately 1/25 children, are usually outgrown, and the majority are harmless. Meaning that the child usually recovers completely with no evidence of lasting effects. ninds.nih.gov/disorders/febrile_seizures/… – Tammy Sep 18 at 0:46
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Not only that, but every time your child receives a vaccination you should also receive a fact sheet that explains when you should contact the doctor given various side effects and signs of a reaction, and almost always fever is listed as one that you should immediately call the doctor for after a vaccination. As long as the fever is controlled, the side effects of fever (such as seizures) may also be limited. – Adam Davis Dec 10 at 4:29
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When I asked my daughter's pediatrician about this before the shot, she said that the whole scare about MMR vaccine was based on a highly flawed and long since discredited study somewhere (I think she said Canada) but now has a life of its own just like many myths that get perpetuated by the media or other ways.

I didn't independently try to verify what she said because I figured regardless, the benefits outweigh the risks, but anyway you might want to dig to see whether our pediatrician's information is useful.

I know some people try to hedge risk by spreading out shots - I don't know whether that's a scientifically valid approach or not.

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It was the UK, not Canada. You can read about the study in question at en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MMR_vaccine_controversy -- with links to actual references that can be checked, since you shouldn't necessarily believe everything you read on Wikipedia without corroboration. – dave0 Sep 24 at 18:07
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A recent issue of Wired Magazine had a very good article exploring the Anti-Vaccination lobbies in the US and UK.

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I'll start by saying, "Definitely vaccinate!"

That out of the way, I've heard more anecdotal tales of children having bad reactions to vaccines than I feel like studies suggest there should be. The one that stands out most is a case in the small rural county where I live where a girl started showing symptoms of autism at a young age immediately after receiving a vaccine. That could, of course, be coincidental, since that's about when Autism symptoms normally manifest anyway. What sets this one apart is that after several years the family paid out of pocket for an expensive procedure to remove mercury from their by-then 12-year-old daughter's body that insurance wouldn't cover because they said there was statistically no way a vaccine could be involved. The treatment resulted in immediate improvements and an almost-complete recovery in the girl.

It's cases like this, where acting as though the problem is really caused by a vaccine yields a treatment that actually works, that lead me to believe there may be something to this. Add to that the fact that drug companies have the discretion to only publish results from trials that show favorable results. Any link between a vaccine and autism would generally have to come from an independent, government-funded study.

And yet I still say you should vaccinate. Why? I can't cite anything because it's been a while, but when we were first investigating the issue for our own children I remember three things that stood out:

  1. The statistics show that disease they prevent and the chance to catch it is generally still worse than the possible side-effects. The odds of a vaccine causing autism are much, much lower than the odds your child would catch or propogate a possibly deadly disease without the vaccine.
  2. The problem is not with the vaccines, but with the preservatives (namely mercury), and even then it's only when you get too many at one time.
  3. The Mercury-based thimerosal perservative is being phased out, and shouldn't be present at all in the vaccines used for children.

So, always always get the vaccination. But if the doctor wants to administer 3 in the same day, you may want to accept just one of them and politely ask for a short delay on the other two. Come back next week, next month, or even the next checkup and get the others then.

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This is the way I feel too. It's definitely important to vaccinate...and yet. It seems that the vaccine schedule has exploded compared to two or three decades ago. And some vaccines seem questionable to me, like Hep B (is it really a major problem in the US?), or HPV (who'd even heard of cervical cancer before they started touting...and legislating...a vaccine for it?). You may disagree with either example, but the point is that there should be room to affirm the benefits of vaccination in general while questioning whether particular vaccines are really worthwhile. – Kyralessa Aug 2 at 23:23
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My wife is a pediatrician and we know of no other pediatricians (at least in this area) who have not vaccinated their own children... Take that for whatever its worth.

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Personally, I felt bad having my son get some vaccinations. He's 18 months old now, so he's had a few.

I felt that he shouldn't because of some of these horror stories. But at the end of the day, I felt that there was a bit of peer pressure and lots of examples of good stories (eg. kids not getting sick, etc). Also, the fear factor of 'no vacinaction means my son has a higher possibility of getting something, later on' scared me too.

Nothing scientific there, so sorry about that. But that was my personal dilema involved with this.

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I personally feel that all kids should be vaccinated. Yes, there are definite risks with vaccinating, but without them, we are bringing back diseases such as polio which I feel are much more scary than a small needle.

But if you are truly nervous about them, then just do your research as other people have suggested, weigh your options and show your doctor that you've done your homework. My brother & sister in law delayed all of my nieces' vaccinations for over a year because they wanted to give her time for her immune system to fully develop before they subjected her to any vaccinations. They presented all of their information to their family doctor, who was not happy about it, but he agreed with them since they knew what they were talking about.

I have been vaccinating my boys, but I do plan on delaying the MMR shot as long as I can, since I have heard many stories of bad reactions to it.

Good luck!

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One of the better books on the subject is The Vaccine Book, by Dr. Sears. He doesn't take sides. He just presents the information about the vaccines, what goes into making them, what they do and don't do, and any possible proven side effects. He also updates the book regularly on his website.

Here's the website: http://www.askdrsears.com/thevaccinebook/index.asp

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If the other children your child will meet have been vaccinated, then vaccinations will have less benefit for your child.

However I feel that it is my duty to reduce the risk of my child spreading something that could be fatal to another child.

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The point in your first sentence makes sense, but this post came off as a little mean and judgmental. I tried to tone it down. Please refer to the faq for acceptable answers in the future. – Tammy Sep 25 at 11:36
"If the other children your child will meat have been vaccinated..." It only takes one, and it could be in a grocery store. Unvaccinated kids don't have a neon sign on their heads, either. – ceejayoz Nov 30 at 15:00
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I'm neither for nor against vaccinations but I am for making INFORMED DESCISIONS. I think that everyone knows the BENEFIT of vaccination so I won't go into that. Here are a few links from the "other" side of the coin.

Once again... when I do research I try to take everything with a "grain of salt" and consider the sources, the data, etc. I just like to hear both sides of everything and make my own decision...

http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2001/08/18/vaccine-myths.aspx

(Note: You might have to register to (free) to see the article... but I just read "around" the annoying popup.)

http://www.mercola.com/article/vaccines/legally_avoid_shots.htm

An VERY interesting read that talks about how to properly and RESPONSIBLY deal with doctors, teachers, etc IF you decide to delay or avoid vaccination of your child.

From the article:

As you read this work and put its principles into practice, there are two basic axioms you never want to forget. They are the rock upon which all your actions are based.

  1. Nobody, anywhere or any time and under any circumstances has the right or power in this country to immunize you or your children against your will and conviction. If they attempt to do so, you can legally charge them with "assault with a deadly weapon" and have the full resources of our laws behind you.

  2. At all times in attempting to avoid unwanted immunization, you have the Law of the Land behind you. Those who would try to vaccinate you against your will are on very shaky ground. Into every compulsory immunization law in America are written legal exceptions and waivers which are there specifically to protect you from the attempted tyranny of officialdom. It is not only your right, but your obligation to use them, if this is what your conscience tells you.

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I don't understand the two basic axioms you list here. They both look to me like "you cannot be forced to immunize yourself or your kids". How is the second different from the first? – Graeme Dec 3 at 11:38
@Graeme it's not... it was a snippet from the article. That's why I said, "From the article:" :-) I find the negative vote on this answer rather interesting. To the best of my knowledge there is nothing "incorrect/false" in saying, "Do your own research and make an informed decision." but it seems that the group disagrees. :-) I PERSONALLY plan on vaccinating my daughter... but I do plan on waiting a little bit so her brain/body can develop more... just in case. But that's my personal decision based on what I've read from BOTH sides. – KPW Dec 11 at 6:12
Downvotes are given when you disagree with a post, not when there's something "false" – JJJ Dec 11 at 13:44
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Juan, where did you read that? I'm looking at moms4mom.com/faq and it indicates "misinformation" and asks the user to state in a comment WHAT exactly is wrong. If the whole system just went around down-voting every answer they didn't like it wouldn't be a very good system. :-) For example, I'm actually PRO-vaccination... but I also believe in doing my own research and making an INFORMED decision. If that's something people "disagree" with then I'm shocked. :-) – KPW Dec 11 at 17:42
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So, based on that logic... I should down vote every answer here that doesn't agree with mine? Seems downright silly to me but its becoming very clear that few people (if anyone) bothered to read the links I posted. The "two axioms" are NOT my writing, they're from the article. I edited my post to make that clearer. If you'd have clicked the link you'd have seen that. :-) I also feel that encouraging people to do their own research and make an INFORMED decision IS good advice. All too often people blindly take the doctor's word for it. Remember, Thalidomide was "completely safe" once too. – KPW Dec 14 at 23:21
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I choose to vaccinate my older son but i did give him the MMR seperatly, the single mumps vaccine is no longer avavilable, so i am currently undecided on giving my younger son the combined MMR or to vaccinate him with Measles an Rubella at 13 months and then give him the combined vaccination at a around the age of 10.

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Chances are things will turn out OK when you vaccinate, but today's medicine unjustifiably over vaccinates.

The number of vaccines your kids will be subject to and the time in between the shots and the mixing of strains (MMR, DPT) and the preservatives in the vaccines, not to mention the spurious methods employed over the history of vaccine creation (i.e. using aborted babies tissue) all should lead you to a healthy scepticism over the necessity of vaccinating your children.

I don't mean to tell you what to do because everyone is worried that their kids will get sick one way or another and that'd be terrible. One piece of advice I will give you is that if your pediatrician pressures you into vaccinating your children and refuses to treat your unvaccinated children than you should find a new doctor because I know for a fact that not all of them are so gung-ho about vaccinations.

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-1: I see your crackpot "vaccine liberation" and raise you a "Science Based Medicine .org": sciencebasedmedicine.org/?p=4431 – Scott May 19 at 1:29
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...and I would -1 again, for the link about the relationship between aborted baby tissue and autism. From the study author himself: "Our study draws no causal linkages with anything and the recent increase in autistic disorder, and certainly not to the use of fetal tissues in vaccines." reference: sciencebasedparenting.com/2010/04/22/… – Scott May 19 at 1:33
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It wasn't to provide a link between aborted baby tissue and autism, it was to prove that there once was aborted baby tissue in vaccines, which should be morally reprehensible to all parents. Why is raising your children without unnecessary medical treatment considered crackpottish? Personally, I'm not convinced vaccines do children a ton of harm, but why subject all children to the same institutional treatment when not all children are in the same institution? – Pete May 19 at 12:44
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@Pete: "there once was aborted baby tissue in vaccines" has no relevance on whether or not you should get your child vaccinated now. "Why subject all children...": that's exactly the question being asked. Should we or shouldn't we? What are the pros and cons? Your opinions on the issue one way or the other doesn't constitute a useful answer. I'm not picking on your personally. Please see our back-it-up principle: moms4mom.com/back-it-up – Scott May 19 at 16:17
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@Pete: As we've said before, there's no way to validate that a person is an expert here, so we need to focus on the merits of the argument itself. If someone posted a link to a peer reviewed study claiming a link between vaccines and some negative outcome, I'd vote it up and take note. If you have comments about how we're running the site, please take them to meta: meta.moms4mom.com – Scott May 20 at 9:54
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